Zambie Mafia - Day 4 - Game Over - Town Victory

[Enderfive]

When you get turned into a zombie you can win with them by becoming the majority group? I assume the win condition for zombie leader also (at least partially) applies to other zombies else they can just throw the game.

Right, but that's not a town win condition, that's the zombie win condition. So when you talk about you specifically being able to win with zombies as you are now, as you seem to have done, it kind of sets some alarms off in my mind. If you don't understand what I'm talking about, then here's Inffy's statement:

Vatumok - points on day 0 didn't make sense to me, felt like he was just trying to make sure he was saying something so as to not look suspicious. Went against a town win condition by saying him and his inn-mates should win with the zombies if one was infected.

And here's your answer:

Yes I went against the town win condition, however, I didn't go against my own win condition

From this it honestly looks like you're saying that winning with the zombies already is your win condition, so while I'm not entirely sold on you being scum, it does seem like a pretty considerable possibility.

 

[Vatumok]

From this it honestly looks like you're saying that winning with the zombies already is your win condition, so while I'm not entirely sold on you being scum, it does seem like a pretty considerable possibility.

What I meant to say with this was that it is an anti-town statement but that it doesn't mean I'm bad because it's a possible way for me to win being a townie at that point. It's also why I said it in the inn, I would've never brought something up during day discussion. I would have nothing to win by bringing that up if I would be anti-town.

 

[Dess]

In all honesty what vatu is saying makes sense, the moment somebody becomes infected they no longer have a way to win town so they need to win zombie. Why is this making him look suspicious?

 

[Infected_alien8_]

In all honesty what vatu is saying makes sense, the moment somebody becomes infected they no longer have a way to win town so they need to win zombie. Why is this making him look suspicious?

Because as a town, you shouldn't be offering yourself to the zombie mob, you should be scumhunting them, because if you're town your win condition is: win with town, and it should stay as that win condition until you are no longer town. Otherwise it just feels a bit like gamethrowing to be honest, working with another faction when you're still technically a part of town.

 

[Vatumok]

Because as a town, you shouldn't be offering yourself to the zombie mob, you should be scumhunting them, because if you're town your win condition is: win with town, and it should stay as that win condition until you are no longer town. Otherwise it just feels a bit like gamethrowing to be honest, working with another faction when you're still technically a part of town.

Though when did I ever work with zombies? Also you didn't respond to the part where I said that I'd have nothing to win saying that as zombie leader. This strawmanning is the reason why my intuition says Ltin and/or Infected_Alien8_ may be bad. It's seems like this attack on me is a red herring while the actual zombies stay unnoticed or unblamed. I posted that as an alternate strategy by using the inn mechanic, if I was zombie leader I could've just infected them. Personally I think the zombies are between the people that have been kinda silent and haven't contributed a lot like Faliara, Rune/Geek or JK. I would like to hear something from them and get actual new information than continue this pointless discussion.

 

[Ltin]

Though when did I ever work with zombies? Also you didn't respond to the part where I said that I'd have nothing to win saying that as zombie leader. This strawmanning is the reason why my intuition says Ltin and/or Infected_Alien8_ may be bad. It's seems like this attack on me is a red herring while the actual zombies stay unnoticed or unblamed. I posted that as an alternate strategy by using the inn mechanic, if I was zombie leader I could've just infected them. Personally I think the zombies are between the people that have been kinda silent and haven't contributed a lot like Faliara, Rune/Geek or JK. I would like to hear something from them and get actual new information than continue this pointless discussion.

You haven't that we know of, but you expressed your desire to.

 

[Infected_alien8_]

Though when did I ever work with zombies? Also you didn't respond to the part where I said that I'd have nothing to win saying that as zombie leader. This strawmanning is the reason why my intuition says Ltin and/or Infected_Alien8_ may be bad. It's seems like this attack on me is a red herring while the actual zombies stay unnoticed or unblamed. I posted that as an alternate strategy by using the inn mechanic, if I was zombie leader I could've just infected them. Personally I think the zombies are between the people that have been kinda silent and haven't contributed a lot like Faliara, Rune/Geek or JK. I would like to hear something from them and get actual new information than continue this pointless discussion.

I never said I thought you were the zombie leader. I think you're the Lone Survivor.

Plus:

Notty being killed must almost surely been by samurai (or maybe zombie hunter)

Infected_alien8_ Ltin said that if he's not infected or dead after tonight that he will trust us more. But if one of these things happens then his suspicious in meaningless, there it is pointless to say.

Because there are 3 death, one was killed by zombies, one by mafia and one by a town role (presumably). The town role that most likely killed someone is the Samurai by being suspcious and Notty is the only one of the 3 deaths that can visit people in the night.

Either you just didn't think about the option that the Lone Survivor has the potential to kill, or you already know he doesn't, hence why you were so sure it was a town role that killed Notty.

 

[Infected_alien8_]

And like Ltin said, you haven't worked with the zombies, but you offered the idea to, which in my opinion is not a town thing to do. I'm not completely convinced you aren't anti town but for now you remain my #1 suspect

 

[Infected_alien8_]

I'm not completely convinced you aren't anti town but for now you remain my #1 suspect

ARE anti town*

 

[Mooglie]

uh i just read over roles but i don't think zombies killed anyone last night since they said they kill or infect based on the ratio of zombies to others, and maybe that means they can start killing at half people but then again that means they just have majority to lynch during day?

i don't think lone survivor can kill since there's already zombies, mafia, zombie hunter, and suspicious samurai (kinda) so that's a lot of killing roles for the amount of people

 

[Ltin]

uh i just read over roles but i don't think zombies killed anyone last night since they said they kill or infect based on the ratio of zombies to others, and maybe that means they can start killing at half people but then again that means they just have majority to lynch during day?

i don't think lone survivor can kill since there's already zombies, mafia, zombie hunter, and suspicious samurai (kinda) so that's a lot of killing roles for the amount of people

I think it's a random chance that gets higher as the ratio decreases. At least that's how I understand it.
Maybe Samlen can offer some clarification.

 

[sessybessy]

Geekenstein - Said nothing (Rune) so automatically suspect.

Okay okay.

The reason I, not Rune, haven't said anything yet is because by the time I was placed into Rune's role it was night time so I couldn't respond to anything. Rune obviously had to resign because of personal issues too. I'm still trying to catch up with the gist of this entire mafia, with what the inns are and stuff, I'm trying to see who I believe is suspicious too.

 

[Ltin]

Okay okay.

The reason I, not Rune, haven't said anything yet is because by the time I was placed into Rune's role it was night time so I couldn't respond to anything. Rune obviously had to resign because of personal issues too. I'm still trying to catch up with the gist of this entire mafia, with what the inns are and stuff, I'm trying to see who I believe is suspicious too.

He is saying that rune was suspicious for not posting. It isn't anything you did.

 

[Infected_alien8_]

Geekenstein are you in an inn?

 

[sessybessy]

Geekenstein are you in an inn?

I'm not sure what an inn is tbh

 

[Infected_alien8_]

I'm not sure what an inn is tbh

Are you in a chat with people at night? A PM?

 

[Samlen]

I think it's a random chance that gets higher as the ratio decreases. At least that's how I understand it.
Maybe Samlen can offer some clarification.

(Taken from first post)
"Zombie Leader - Wins if zombies have majority
-With other Zombies, chooses one person each night that will be infected OR killed, based on current player/zombie ratio"

This is all I can say about it without revealing the more specific mechanics \o/

 

[sessybessy]

Are you in a chat with people at night? A PM?

No, I'm not in an inn then :x

 

[Infected_alien8_]

So, people in inns:

Inn #1
Notty (Doc)
Ltin
Vatumok

Inn #2
Infected
Hip (Cop)
Caff (Scientist)

Inn #3
Ender
??
??
(both presumably alive)

So that's 9 people in an inn. And oh look, 9 town roles. Interesting.

Given the OP nature of the zombies, does anyone think it's a terrible idea that the inns are designed the way they are because everyone in them is a member of town (at least, at the start of the game)? Bit unfair for the mafia if we were to work it out I suppose, but maybe it's not that far fetched an idea?

 

[Infected_alien8_]

If nobody thinks its a terrible idea, maybe we could try lynching someone who we find suspicious and who isn't in an inn. Ender could out the other two in his inn and we could see who's not in one and there's probably one of the inactive people who aren't, and we could lynch them. That way we could test out this theory. I know, ironic coming from me who didn't want to test the theory about one person being mafia per inn, but from my pov that theory is confirmed wrong, and I actually think there's something to this theory. We need to lynch today, and if nobody's convinced enough of vat/ltin, we could policy lynch an inactive who isn't in an inn. It won't prove the theory obviously, but it's a direction we could take. We might get lucky and find the Zombie Leader. Personally I'm confused about Vat, because my gut is kind of telling he's town for some reason, yet reason says he's not, so I'm not overly happy lynching him anymore, but if this idea of lynching outside of inns isn't agreed upon, I'd probably place my vote on him. Part of me also kind of wants to respect our doctor's last wishes and vote ltin but I'm nowhere near convinced enough of him being scum for me to comfortably do that, though I'm no longer as sure of his innocence as I was earlier on.

Thoughts?

 

[JKangaroo]

Given the OP nature of the zombies, does anyone think it's a terrible idea that the inns are designed the way they are because everyone in them is a member of town (at least, at the start of the game)? Bit unfair for the mafia if we were to work it out I suppose, but maybe it's not that far fetched an idea?
---------------------
If nobody thinks its a terrible idea, maybe we could try lynching someone who we find suspicious and who isn't in an inn. Ender could out the other two in his inn and we could see who's not in one and there's probably one of the inactive people who aren't, and we could lynch them. That way we could test out this theory.

It's not... terrible. But I think it's quite bad.
Maybe that's mostly because I'm not in an inn.

But seriously, no, I highly doubt that would be the case. When I was first introduced to inns back in the Bloody Masquerade season, there was a trend of (if I remember right) 1 mafia(or assassin), 1 third-party, and 2 townies per inn, with 3 inns in total. If I also remember right--- we were wrong, and the composition of inns hasn't really mattered in other seasons with similar mechanics.
Unless the game is focused around the idea of inns or night groups of people then I doubt inns would be intentionally made with certain people in mind. There would be an obvious pattern that would unintentionally reveal certain factions, both town and anti-town, that may not have been there otherwise, and to me that doesn't seem like it would both be in the spirit of the game or make sense, especially with the setup Sam has gone for (I could be wrong of course).
Being placed in an inn is most likely randomly generated like in most cases.

 

[JKangaroo]

Also yeah, I haven't been keeping up with the thread as much as I should be.
Sorry 'bout that.

 

[Infected_alien8_]

Or maybe that's the trick of it - the fact that this theory seems unfair makes us doubt it, and so the theory isn't unfair because it's so unlikely we'll actually go along with it. I don't know, it's just something I'd like to consider, especially since the people who aren't in inns are under a kind of general suspicion for me (and I think I know who's in Ender's and there's nobody that I think ruins the theory) for being quiet and various reasons. Maybe I'm looking into something that isn't there, but I'd like opinions from people in inns as to whether or not you think this theory has any validity to it at all or if I'm just bonkers please. I just feel like the likelihood of town winning this game is so damn low because the zombies are so OP that there has to be something to budge it up, and maybe the inns were designed so that people would eventually be in an inn with three claimed and uncc town roles and so could use them to their advantage or something, so long as none were infected. I don't know. And yeah I know we weren't even meant to have 16 people/9 town, but the original amount of slots was 15 town roles, meaning two more inns of three, so he could have just altered it for this amount of players.

 

[Mooglie]

Or maybe that's the trick of it - the fact that this theory seems unfair makes us doubt it, and so the theory isn't unfair because it's so unlikely we'll actually go along with it

are you on drugs

 

[Infected_alien8_]

are you on drugs

fight me