Republic - Completed

[Nottykitten]

Yeah, which ties them up for the night.

Also remember it takes two maf to kill a player unless the maf attempting the kill is Gula, who can do it alone

'ties them up for the night' he says as Mafia will not only kill the toxicologist, the poisoner player dies, commits their usual nightkill and the rev also kills someone.

Thats 4 kills during that night, essentially 3 created by the mafia. I doubt the Mafia would lose sleep over more town people being dead.

 

[Nottykitten]

the poisoner player dies

poisoned*

 

[Hunter]

I'm not stating these things because they nullify plans, just keeping these mechanics in mind as they could affect the way the game goes

Like, might've read it wrong but the possible kills are:

Assassin's nightkill (poison in democracy)
Town lynch/ representative lynch if democracy
Dictator kill
Edge case of vengeful getting subpoenaed, which is unlikely with the current plan

maf default kill
Maf poison


revolutionary kill

And then there's the maf granny mechanism

Right now though, it's probably best to decide who we want on the council for now and work from there

 

[Nottykitten]

Right now though, it's probably best to decide who we want on the council for now and work from there

I disagree, the best thing we can do is agree that a democracy is a losing play and figure out how best to manouvre our massclaim to benefit us most.

 

[Infected_alien8_]

We should have the three useless PRs claim still and elect them in the council and have one of them be elected as dictator but without us knowing which

But do Mafia get to return to Mafia chat once they make a dictatorship? Since then they'll know who it is if they were on the council

 

[Hunter]

Depending on the plays maf makes with the granny, the kills per night will likely vary

we could get lucky and the rev and maf could hit each other

interesting to note that maf doesn't have to kill, but can't think of why they wouldn't rn

 

[Nottykitten]

We should have the three useless PRs claim still and elect them in the council and have one of them be elected as dictator but without us knowing which

But do Mafia get to return to Mafia chat once they make a dictatorship? Since then they'll know who it is if they were on the council

During the evening all Mafia can talk (thus people in council can give into to the mafia). During the night a new Mafia chat is made with all members who aren't in court. (So when I was subpoenad by Danni last game I wasnt in Maf night chat)

 

[Hunter]

I disagree, the best thing we can do is agree that a democracy is a losing play and figure out how best to manouvre our massclaim to benefit us most.

Obviously we're going to get a dictatorship at some point, I wasn't saying we should keep the initial democracy the whole game

Trying to massclaim and predict the outcome of the entire game based on numbers alone sounds like it'd screw up. This game has intricacies and I doubt it'd be cracked that easily by brute forcing maf/rev into claiming nilla and gunning all of them down

it doesn't seem to account for the trackers and watchers etc, and nullifies mafs stalker completely

 

[Hunter]

It could be a decent plan- I remember you started a massclaim before in an earlier game, forget how that turned out though.

Bad gut feeling about having everyone claim d1.

 

[Infected_alien8_]

Obviously we're going to get a dictatorship at some point, I wasn't saying we should keep the initial democracy the whole game

Trying to massclaim and predict the outcome of the entire game based on numbers alone sounds like it'd screw up. This game has intricacies and I doubt it'd be cracked that easily by brute forcing maf/rev into claiming nilla and gunning all of them down

it doesn't seem to account for the trackers and watchers etc, and nullifies mafs stalker completely

But if you read Notty's post of the way it'd play out, even if we lynch completely optimally with our PRs helping, the Mafia simply has too many kills (and Rev) to make it realistic we'd win under a democracy

 

[Nottykitten]

it doesn't seem to account for the trackers and watchers etc, and nullifies mafs stalker completely

Trackers, watchers and cops are irrelevant because in the scenario I pointed out we already lynch a Mafia every single day, yet theres simply too many nightkills (2+) for us to deal with. With 2 every night we have a total of 0 mislynches, and though an event like the revo killing a Mafia might give us 1 mislynch, events like the granny deaths arent even taken into account here adding more kills. The Mafia poisoner has guaranteed kills aswell because the toxicologists cant save someone or they die aswell so that almost guarantees 3 kills per night even. With 1 lynch a day we can't beat this many kills

 

[Hunter]

I literally just said we wouldn't have democracy the whole game.

Correct me if I'm wrong, notty's plan is:
Have everyone claim, immediately make 1/3 roles from last game's plan dictator, who should capture a villager claim and kill them regardless of what they say, have town-sided vig kill a hopefully different villager claim

Repeat until all fake villager claims are exterminated?

 

[Hunter]

I literally just said we wouldn't have democracy the whole game.

Correct me if I'm wrong, notty's plan is:
Have everyone claim, immediately make 1/3 roles from last game's plan dictator, who should capture a villager claim and kill them regardless of what they say, have town-sided vig kill a hopefully different villager claim

Repeat until all fake villager claims are exterminated?

And no prs do anything so granny can't kill them, I guess?

 

[Infected_alien8_]

I literally just said we wouldn't have democracy the whole game.

Correct me if I'm wrong, notty's plan is:
Have everyone claim, immediately make 1/3 roles from last game's plan dictator, who should capture a villager claim and kill them regardless of what they say, have town-sided vig kill a hopefully different villager claim

Repeat until all fake villager claims are exterminated?

If we start off with a democracy we make it even less likely we'll win when we eventually do switch to autocracy because we'd have wasted time not knowing where to aim our lynches

 

[Nottykitten]

I literally just said we wouldn't have democracy the whole game.

Even if we only have democracy for 1 or 2 days, 1 mislynch is a lose and a democracy is a recipe for lynching town members. You need 3 unCC'd people in it or the mafia could take over, and thus you only have 2 people to lynch from which we saw go wrong last game.

Event if you go to a dictatorship later to increase town kills, in two nights poisoner kills and granny deaths have already worn down the town to a point where winning is simply impossible for the town even with an extra nightkill. Even if you go into dictatorship tomorrow the dictator not only has to choose to want to kill the player(who doesn't have a big chance of being Mafia since we don't have some citizen pool to choose form then), they also have to be Mafia or they're actively contributing to the towns downfall.

Correct me if I'm wrong, notty's plan is:
Have everyone claim, immediately make 1/3 roles from last game's plan dictator, who should capture a villager claim and kill them regardless of what they say, have town-sided vig kill a hopefully different villager claim

Repeat until all fake villager claims are exterminated?

Essentially, but we should work out how we'll go about the massclaim since that could decide how this game goes. A more abstract version is to claim who is a PR and who isn't a PR.

 

[Hunter]

It feels like it's just us three in the game today lmao

This plan might actually work, it's just...

... boring, really. Irrelevantizes nearly all prs, the entire interrogation mechanic, and reduces the entire game to scumhunting between village ccs.

Also worried that some unconcerned facet of the game could blow this plan apart and result in a town loss.

 

[Infected_alien8_]

It feels like it's just us three in the game today lmao

This plan might actually work, it's just...

... boring, really. Irrelevantizes nearly all prs, the entire interrogation mechanic, and reduces the entire game to scumhunting between village ccs.

Also worried that some unconcerned facet of the game could blow this plan apart and result in a town loss.

Well it seems to be our only decent shot at winning so as boring as it may be, it will be less frustrating than just waiting to lose because we mislynched and have almost no chance of redemption

 

[Nottykitten]

Well it seems to be our only decent shot at winning so as boring as it may be, it will be less frustrating than just waiting to lose because we mislynched and have almost no chance of redemption

Our only other chance of winning is both the poisoner and revo dying early

 

[Mooglie]

also as monitor last game i was just gonna go from the bottom of the player list and then up and when i was eventually subpoenad/claimed i would just say how i've been doing it and so reports that were probably accurate would be revealed and the names of everyone i visited would be known

this could work with the villager claims, as the only way to counter it would be to roleswap the designated visited person with a mafia, which uses up the roleblocker for the night & is a less effective way to use the roleblocker

i mean the fact theres 2 villagers who appear mafia & 1 mafia who appears town from memory it's not the best but atleast it puts some order!

 

[Mooglie]

this could work with the villager claims

as in from all the claims, just match them up with their player number in the first post and go in descending order

 

[Hunter]

Less boring and more disappointing tbh

If Gula dies, then maf has to sacrifice two night actions to perform a kill. The godfather would likely be one of those if they're still alive, but dissenters would be forced to lose a night action

 

[Nottykitten]

also as monitor last game i was just gonna go from the bottom of the player list and then up and when i was eventually subpoenad/claimed i would just say how i've been doing it and so reports that were probably accurate would be revealed and the names of everyone i visited would be known

this could work with the villager claims, as the only way to counter it would be to roleswap the designated visited person with a mafia, which uses up the roleblocker for the night & is a less effective way to use the roleblocker

i mean the fact theres 2 villagers who appear mafia & 1 mafia who appears town from memory it's not the best but atleast it puts some order!

Maybe part of the massclaim plan could be to have the monitor also claim assassin so the Mafia have a 50% chance to kill the monitor and reveal 1 person instead of killing the assassin.

 

[Infected_alien8_]

also as monitor last game i was just gonna go from the bottom of the player list and then up and when i was eventually subpoenad/claimed i would just say how i've been doing it and so reports that were probably accurate would be revealed and the names of everyone i visited would be known

this could work with the villager claims, as the only way to counter it would be to roleswap the designated visited person with a mafia, which uses up the roleblocker for the night & is a less effective way to use the roleblocker

i mean the fact theres 2 villagers who appear mafia & 1 mafia who appears town from memory it's not the best but atleast it puts some order!

Thing is if they do that then Mafia can know which villager the monitor is going on and can swap them and granny and get another extra kill

 

[Unusual_Dood]

I also believe autocracy is the way to go, but why is massclaiming favourable?

 

[Infected_alien8_]

I also believe autocracy is the way to go, but why is massclaiming favourable?

Because the dictator won't know who to kill otherwise