Republic - Completed

Mooglie

The Local Cow
Joined
Sep 23, 2011
Messages
1,195
Reaction score
5,772
that already got ruled out, since, as sploork pointed out, you were seen visiting by aqua, so you couldn't have claimed citizen.
that still didnt rule out the possibility of ltin being a citizen tho

inf only had 3 roles he could possibly claim but that didnt change the probability of ltin being the same rule (oops ive violated enders math rule by saying probability)
 

Faliara

Member
Joined
Oct 20, 2012
Messages
2,588
Reaction score
3,080
Right, I've been re-reading the pages after page 100 or so to make a post so I'm going to just say something that popped up in my head before I do something stupid like include this in the post I'm making;

(tbh i was actually gonna vote to lynch notty today it was very evident they were mafia now)
but yeah i agree that hk is mafia
INF IS STILL UNCC THO AND IT DOESNT MAKE SENSE FOR THERE TO BE ANY SITUATION WHERE HE ACTUALLY ROLECOPPED LTIN
except notty was mafia + told evening chat members who the subpoena target would be
BUT STILL WHY DID THEY SWAP INF AND GULA (OR INF AND ME SINCE I VISITED HUNTER N1 AS WELL)

anyway to defend myself (despite being uncc but i am less trustworthy than inf!)
IT MADE SENSE TO KEEP THE REV CLAIM ALIVE
yeah thats it

choose to lose the game and lynch me since i signed an imaginary note saying i would quit mafia forever if notty was mafia so GOODBYE
(ill keep playing this game since im not a garbage person <3)
Oog, you know that mafia members who aren't Gula need two people to carry out a kill, right? You know that you saying you also visited Hunter on Night 1 doesn't help your or Inffy's cases, right? You know that the Observer's action isn't counted as a visit, right?
 

Mooglie

The Local Cow
Joined
Sep 23, 2011
Messages
1,195
Reaction score
5,772
Who says I didn’t lie hmmmm?
how is that even relevant here

LITERALLY ANY OF THE PRs WHO CLAIMED AFTER LTIN DYING COULD BE LYING
BUT NO ME AND INF ARE THE CLEAR LIARS SINCE WE DECIDED TO SUPPORT NOTTY
EVEN THOUGH WE CAN'T BOTH BE LYING
AAAAAAA

people should really have more reason to believe inf over any of the other claimed PRs due to aquas tracking report
 

Faliara

Member
Joined
Oct 20, 2012
Messages
2,588
Reaction score
3,080
Right, for anyone who's hoping for autocracy, plsase don't let Oog or Inffy on the council.

Maybe it's not a 100% guarantee that either of them are mafia dissenters, but both of them are pretty suspicious for quite a few reasons.

They may be uncounterclaimed town members, but due to the roles they claimed being useful power roles, anyone who counterclaimed against them would be prime targets for being killed or poisoned by the mafia (as Aqua the tracker, Roob the monitor and Endy the assassin all suffered last night) and thus would be more hesitant to claim. At least one of them, I think, is a dissenter.

The reason I consider Inffy suspicious is because of these reasons;
that's true.

wait, if he was seen visiting someone, his claim had to be a visiting PR.

there were only two unclaimed PR's at the time that could have visited under autocracy:
Tox and subversive

however, since the target of the tox is alerted when they are given an antidote, he could easily have been exposed by the person who received it.

hence, claiming sub was his only viable option.
I looked through what happened early during Day 2 again, and remember when Aqua revealed that Inffy visited Hunter on Night 1?

He took too long to claim. Everyone was repeating 'claim or die', and Inf seemed to keep avoiding the question until later, where he claimed to be the Subversive. I'm guessing that, within that timeframe, Inf was trying to see what options he had that he could claim through the role list.

The reason I started having doubts that Inf was lying about being the Subversive was because no one counterclaimed, but of course that wasn't the best idea- the Subversive is a useful power role, one that can be used under autocracy (which Notty, a known dissenter, kept aiming for) and if the Subversive is someone among those who are still alive they might be targeted as soon as they revealed what role they had, the same way Aqua and Roob were killed while Endy was poisoned last night. It's the kind of outcome the Subversive would probably want to avoid.

yeah, inf is probably a dissenter
As for why I consider Oog suspicious...

Well.

For one thing, they were a defendant of Notty, which automatically makes him suspicious- more so than HK, as at least he has the excuse of coming in last minute in contrast. Otherwise...
It's just
It's just plain dumb

For one thing, Oog apparently had the dumb luck of choosing people who died on both nights. I get being unlucky very well, but that's still shifty. Then there's their post after Notty was executed. I couldn't understand anything of it at first, but as I said in the post above after looking at it again;

Right, I've been re-reading the pages after page 100 or so to make a post so I'm going to just say something that popped up in my head before I do something stupid like include this in the post I'm making;



Oog, you know that mafia members who aren't Gula need two people to carry out a kill, right? You know that you saying you also visited Hunter on Night 1 doesn't help your or Inffy's cases, right? You know that the Observer's action isn't counted as a visit, right?
It gives off the impression that Oog and Inf did the nightkill together. I had thought for a second, 'no way, that's too dumb, that's too obvious' but the way Ooglie posts is so confusing and disjointed that it's a viable tactic, posting in a way that they seem as though they're trying to be helpful while also causing confusion.

Speaking of Oog and Inf doing the nightkill together;

how
are
>>>both<<<
me
and
inf
lying
about
our
roles
Inf said this as well. Whenever it's brought up that either you or Inf could be claiming Ltin's role, you both say 'but we can't both be lying!' You can if the real role holders don't want to admit their role only to die the next night- and they probably will die the next night, considering what happened to the other power roles.

I'm pretty sure I'm only still alive because I'm hard to kill and don't have a night action as the Bulletproof, making me less of a target than other power roles- speaking of which, why aren't you two dead? Inffy may be less of a target since his role only works under autocracy and we're currently under democracy, but you? Your action may fail if your target dies, but you can still find the poisoner, the role cop, the target switcher, the blocker (though that one's dead). If you were really the Observer, you'd be more of a target than Roob, who can't exactly do much damage as the Monitor until he dies- that could be avoided by killing him early, but it could also be avoided by not killing him at all.

You two don't aim for each other. You don't aim to lynch each other, you both bring up how you're both uncounterclaimed thus far, and you both say the same thing when we bring up how both of you are suspicious- 'we can't be both be lying'. That's a pretty good tactic, I admit. Once one of you dies, the other is cleared of suspicion.

But the manner in which you two carry it out doesn't work as well as the plan.
 

Mooglie

The Local Cow
Joined
Sep 23, 2011
Messages
1,195
Reaction score
5,772
For one thing, Oog apparently had the dumb luck of choosing people who died on both nights
who would you have suggested i visited
ENTERTAIN ME
my only job is to catch the poisoner
my role is USELESS
i can only catch the poisoner by watching the people most likely to die or be poisoned since it's really a toss up between them
Inf said this as well. Whenever it's brought up that either you or Inf could be claiming Ltin's role, you both say 'but we can't both be lying!' You can if the real role holders don't want to admit their role only to die the next night- and they probably will die the next night, considering what happened to the other power roles.
this is the dumbest thing ever
IF ANYONE IS GOING TO CC US, DO IT NOW THANKS
It gives off the impression that Oog and Inf did the nightkill together. I had thought for a second, 'no way, that's too dumb, that's too obvious' but the way Ooglie posts is so confusing and disjointed that it's a viable tactic, posting in a way that they seem as though they're trying to be helpful while also causing confusion.
and what do you mean disjointed
you said this before and ???
i literally brought up the inf swapping thing on the day aqua and inf claimed
 

Faliara

Member
Joined
Oct 20, 2012
Messages
2,588
Reaction score
3,080
who would you have suggested i visited
ENTERTAIN ME
my only job is to catch the poisoner
my role is USELESS
i can only catch the poisoner by watching the people most likely to die or be poisoned since it's really a toss up between them

this is the dumbest thing ever
IF ANYONE IS GOING TO CC US, DO IT NOW THANKS

and what do you mean disjointed
you said this before and ???
i literally brought up the inf swapping thing on the day aqua and inf claimed
There are more dissenter non-murder roles than just the poisoner- there is a role cop, a target swapper and before Notty’s execution, a blocker. This role can also be used to learn who’s the toxicologist, the town blockers, the doctor, and the tracker. The fact that you are severely underestimating your own ‘role’ does not give me confidence in you.

If they counterclaim now, they’ll likely go the way of Hunter, Velz, Aqua, Roob and soon, Endy- death by role reveal. It would be unwise.

As in, your posts don’t make sense and only gives people headaches- I’m sorry, but I can never understand just what you’re saying until I puzzle out your posts :x
 

Mooglie

The Local Cow
Joined
Sep 23, 2011
Messages
1,195
Reaction score
5,772
As in, your posts don’t make sense and only gives people headaches- I’m sorry, but I can never understand just what you’re saying until I puzzle out your posts :x
please list these people
maybe the fault is with you <3
There are more dissenter non-murder roles than just the poisoner- there is a role cop, a target swapper and before Notty’s execution, a blocker. This role can also be used to learn who’s the toxicologist, the town blockers, the doctor, and the tracker. The fact that you are severely underestimating your own ‘role’ does not give me confidence in you.
yes the plan with hunter was to learn the swapper and possibly the doctor but surprise my report is scrapped if they die

we've literally mass claimed so the other points are useless other than role cop and in that case explain to me how i identify them now - we've mass claimed so they can literally just choose to visit nobody (since they're masquerading as a citizen unless pretending to be whatever PR people ltin was)
 

HKCaper

Almighty Goat
Joined
Oct 21, 2014
Messages
110
Reaction score
1,197
It gives off the impression that Oog and Inf did the nightkill together. I had thought for a second, 'no way, that's too dumb, that's too obvious' but the way Ooglie posts is so confusing and disjointed that it's a viable tactic, posting in a way that they seem as though they're trying to be helpful while also causing confusion.
interesting thought. I'm not sure what to think. One one hand find oog rather suspicious, on the other hand i find it hard to believe both oog and inffy are dessenters.

one of the reasons i find oog susp is because of the fact both his 'targets' for observer died. However, in contrast to the inffy situation, i find that fact that oog hasn't been cc'd a strong indication he is infact the observer. Ofc, like you pointed out, the observer might want to lay low for now, since so many PR's have already fallen, but i'm not sure if that is the right thing to do (if this is happening).

another hint in my eyes is that oog could be mafia, would be the way he stood up for notty and now inffy, but hey coming from me that might not mean as much.
 

Mooglie

The Local Cow
Joined
Sep 23, 2011
Messages
1,195
Reaction score
5,772
would be the way he stood up for notty and now inffy,
ive always stood up for inf??
one of the reasons i find oog susp is because of the fact both his 'targets' for observer died
again I THOUGHT HUNTER WOULD DIE THATS WHY I PICKED HIM I DIDNT KNOW HOW MY ROLE WORKED I THOUGHT I WOULD FIND THE SWAPPER

and the rev killed roob (presumably) and i thought notty was the rev and so wasnt gonna do that (since rev needed monitors help) so i wasnt expecting him to die since mafia were going to kill ender (well surprise not) (tbh i didnt factor in aqua in reality i should have watched him but that still would have returned no report in the end)
 

Infected_alien8_

Garry's Mod Admin
Mafia Host
Joined
Jul 29, 2012
Messages
1,760
Reaction score
6,243
yeah currently i'm toying with the idea that inf isn't the ""fall guy"" (obviously that's notty after completely fucking us with that d0 play) but he's acting a a catalyst of sorts. i honestly think he lucked out and guessed ltin's role; he's too scummy to be town. he's the reason notty survived to today at all imo.
Because I see sense and don't mindlessly bandwagon onto what everyone else says and saw Notty's points were worth listening to?

And no, I was not the only one, thank goodness, or I'd have gone insane

yeah currently i'm toying with the idea that inf isn't the ""fall guy"" (obviously that's notty after completely fucking us with that d0 play) but he's acting a a catalyst of sorts. i honestly think he lucked out and guessed ltin's role; he's too scummy to be town. he's the reason notty survived to today at all imo.


probably should have been obvious from my last posts before that happened but same, although i acknowledge that neither side has more credibility than the other since notty was an ideal bus.


i get what you're saying, and i could picture listings as the rev but i still feel like he's a strange target to 180 onto as hard as danni did


<o> smd

when ender accused him of being a negligent townie and he threw a hissy fit he threw of "if u think im mafia i guess i cant change ur mind" i refuse to believe you missed it cause it was one of the only substantial parts of those few pages. you even put him on your "we should lynch these people cause they claimed civ" list. idk why you're attacking me over this

that's true but i wholly believe you were the reason notty wasn't policy lynched. your spamming singlehandedly made it seem like notty's ass-backwards strategy had visceral support from the town.

fuck off

i'd ask you to be less eccentric but i'm enjoying it so don't
So Notty was an ideal bus yet I'm suspicious for agreeing with her :eek:k_hand:

i get what you're saying, and i could picture listings as the rev but i still feel like he's a strange target to 180 onto as hard as danni did
When did that happen

when ender accused him of being a negligent townie and he threw a hissy fit he threw of "if u think im mafia i guess i cant change ur mind" i refuse to believe you missed it cause it was one of the only substantial parts of those few pages. you even put him on your "we should lynch these people cause they claimed civ" list. idk why you're attacking me over this
in what world was that a "hissy fit", that was literally him being like *lays back* "well what can i do ;)" :thinking:

and yes I put him as a citizen claim in my list, how dare I not agree he was being aggressive even though he very much wasn't

and how am I 'attacking' you

that's true but i wholly believe you were the reason notty wasn't policy lynched. your spamming singlehandedly made it seem like notty's ass-backwards strategy had visceral support from the town.
:thinking: it's almost as if we couldn't lynch yesterday

come on jivvi keep up

Nice argument as to where she didn't make sense

fuck off stop copying inf
copying me how

these four roles claimed after Ltin died. with Ltin janitor'd, and notty probably having shared this with the rest of the dessenters, this means that none very little of the claims are confirmed.

i find it unlikely Ltin was a dessenter, hence he could have been a PR or a citizen. The odds that he was one of those 4 PR's are close to the odds he was a citizen (there are a couple of factors playing a role in this, but i'd say citizen was more likely, but not by a lot).

ANYHOW, this means there is a chance that Ltin was 1 of the 4 listed PR's. Some choose to believe Inffy somehow guessed Ltin's role, but since he was seen visiting Hunter, he can't be the role cop. The other 3 could very well be the mafia role cop, and have visited Ltin, knowing he was likely to get janitored.

CONCLUSIVE, i'm not so sure if we should be placing trust in dess or oog (or myuser for that matter) on the council, without thinking this thru a bit more.

Also, rn there are 2 votes for Dess/Ooglie/Fog/Listing, but not a lot have voted
I feel like everyone's forgotten this but Notty did say that Hunter said he would only kill citizens unless they weren't convincing enough as a PR

I don't see why Ltin was so suspicious, meaning I don't see why he wouldn't be convincing if he claimed a PR

therefore I find it likely Ltin claimed citizen, and was either citizen or mafia (like granny)

tbh this probably happened

how can someone that scummy be confirmed town

he defended notty even after she flipped mafia wtf
scummy because I defended logic

Defended my arguments yes, obviously I wasn't defending her innocence, quote me where I did that or stop strawmanning

dumb fucking luck

also even blatant ccing gives you a shot at taking out a claiming townie



also this
yeah let's go with that because INF AGREED WITH NOTTY SO HE MUST BE MAFIA!111!


I went back and checked and at the time Infected claimed there were 6 prs unclaimed so 1/6 chance of guessing Ltins role if Ltin was town, but for this plan to work Ltin also had to be a PR, so it would require him to be extremly lucky. However, this raises the question, why would Hunter kill a submersive claim?
1/11* including citizens

that's true.

wait, if he was seen visiting someone, his claim had to be a visiting PR.

there were only two unclaimed PR's at the time that could have visited under autocracy:
Tox and subversive

however, since the target of the tox is alerted when they are given an antidote, he could easily have been exposed by the person who received it.

hence, claiming sub was his only viable option.
if I was tox hunter, the person I was revealed to visit, was dead, and thus I couldn't be outed as a liar

, , Runemen4 - You're what is left I'm afraid so you're most suspicious.

Assuming Hunter was on the money with Lt and they are Mafia and dead.
What does this mean

that already got ruled out, since, as sploork pointed out, you were seen visiting by aqua, so you couldn't have claimed citizen.
What I could claim =/= What Ltin could have been

Right, for anyone who's hoping for autocracy, plsase don't let Oog or Inffy on the council.

Maybe it's not a 100% guarantee that either of them are mafia dissenters, but both of them are pretty suspicious for quite a few reasons.

They may be uncounterclaimed town members, but due to the roles they claimed being useful power roles, anyone who counterclaimed against them would be prime targets for being killed or poisoned by the mafia (as Aqua the tracker, Roob the monitor and Endy the assassin all suffered last night) and thus would be more hesitant to claim. At least one of them, I think, is a dissenter.

The reason I consider Inffy suspicious is because of these reasons;



As for why I consider Oog suspicious...

Well.

For one thing, they were a defendant of Notty, which automatically makes him suspicious- more so than HK, as at least he has the excuse of coming in last minute in contrast. Otherwise...
It's just
It's just plain dumb

For one thing, Oog apparently had the dumb luck of choosing people who died on both nights. I get being unlucky very well, but that's still shifty. Then there's their post after Notty was executed. I couldn't understand anything of it at first, but as I said in the post above after looking at it again;



It gives off the impression that Oog and Inf did the nightkill together. I had thought for a second, 'no way, that's too dumb, that's too obvious' but the way Ooglie posts is so confusing and disjointed that it's a viable tactic, posting in a way that they seem as though they're trying to be helpful while also causing confusion.

Speaking of Oog and Inf doing the nightkill together;



Inf said this as well. Whenever it's brought up that either you or Inf could be claiming Ltin's role, you both say 'but we can't both be lying!' You can if the real role holders don't want to admit their role only to die the next night- and they probably will die the next night, considering what happened to the other power roles.

I'm pretty sure I'm only still alive because I'm hard to kill and don't have a night action as the Bulletproof, making me less of a target than other power roles- speaking of which, why aren't you two dead? Inffy may be less of a target since his role only works under autocracy and we're currently under democracy, but you? Your action may fail if your target dies, but you can still find the poisoner, the role cop, the target switcher, the blocker (though that one's dead). If you were really the Observer, you'd be more of a target than Roob, who can't exactly do much damage as the Monitor until he dies- that could be avoided by killing him early, but it could also be avoided by not killing him at all.

You two don't aim for each other. You don't aim to lynch each other, you both bring up how you're both uncounterclaimed thus far, and you both say the same thing when we bring up how both of you are suspicious- 'we can't be both be lying'. That's a pretty good tactic, I admit. Once one of you dies, the other is cleared of suspicion.

But the manner in which you two carry it out doesn't work as well as the plan.
Why on Earth would anyone refuse to cc someone just because they don't want to die

That would be detrimental to town and incredibly selfish and short-sighted

Also why would oog say he visited Hunter for no reason just to be telling the truth about who he actually visited, I don't get it

Also yes I'm not suspicious of oog because unlike 99% of players this game he's actually making some sense to me and he's uncc so unlike 99% of players this game I'm not going to focus on him over anyone else

As in, your posts don’t make sense and only gives people headaches- I’m sorry, but I can never understand just what you’re saying until I puzzle out your posts :x
Bit rude, they make perfect sense and don't give me any headaches, just because you don't understand them doesn't mean they don't make sense and don't act like you're speaking for everyone when you insult someone thank you very much

However, in contrast to the inffy situation, i find that fact that oog hasn't been cc'd a strong indication he is infact the observer.
why is that "in contrast to the inffy situation"
 

HKCaper

Almighty Goat
Joined
Oct 21, 2014
Messages
110
Reaction score
1,197
why is that "in contrast to the inffy situation"
i meant i find it atleast viable you would have guessed Ltin's role. meaning that you being uncc'd doesnt prove you in that sense

for oog however, i feel being uncc'd does likely prove him

if I was tox hunter, the person I was revealed to visit, was dead, and thus I couldn't be outed as a liar
fair
 

Infected_alien8_

Garry's Mod Admin
Mafia Host
Joined
Jul 29, 2012
Messages
1,760
Reaction score
6,243
i meant i find it atleast viable you would have guessed Ltin's role. meaning that you being uncc'd doesnt prove you in that sense

for oog however, i feel being uncc'd does likely prove him


fair
Why am I more viable to guess ltin's role than oog, even though I was confirmed to visit hunter and oog wasn't?
 

Infected_alien8_

Garry's Mod Admin
Mafia Host
Joined
Jul 29, 2012
Messages
1,760
Reaction score
6,243
the way you claimed. as fali pointed out you took quite some time between being asked ('forced') to claim, and claiming sub. which could indicate you were thinking what to claim.
More I was considering whether it was worth claiming or not since I didn't know whether to trust aqua's report, but fair enough I can see why you'd find it suspicious
 
Top