Timeline of Dichotomous Flowers - Game Complete
- Thread starter Alisha
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Infected_alien8_
Garry's Mod Admin
I interpret that as just another reason she added on, and you're saying it's a contradiction since she said before she thinks mafia will start wagons and is suspecting you for jumping on one, but I don't see that as a contradiction since she never said mafia only start wagons, I can say I think mafia might be wanting to start a wagon but also see someone jump on a wagon and think they seemed like mafia
And anything else contradictory she's said just seems like genuine mistakes to me
Anyway good night
Purple doesn't seem to have any insight into the mafia's actions as far as I can see. Could you explain why you feel she does?
I agree with you about Omni. He never contributed anything and now that it looks likely he'll be lynched he's looking a bit mafia.
I don't currently scumread Inffy. I have a slight townread on him still. But remember he pushed for Omni's lynch and although it makes sense to me, I got the feeling he was setting me up as the fall guy if Omni flipped townie. Naturally, that raised some flags for me. But it doesn't mean anything unless Omni flips town, which doesn't look all that likely. Omni is definitely a better lynch than purple, who comes off as a townie who's totally lost it and become overly paranoid, combined with a bit of over focus on herself.
Inffy, Inffy, Inffy, Inffy... If your mafia this makes perfect sense, but if not then surely you must remember last game we played, where you misread me in all the same ways? If not, I'm genuinely disappointed in you.
Anyways, I guess I'd better address this steam, again, before it gets out of hand.
The overarching theme here is that I don't place much stock in reads if there's any scrap of hard evidence that can make up my mind for me.
My vibe on Dess was moderate townread, and there's no point in attempting to better understand it now because it was just vibes. But it doesn't matter any more; Dess gave a fairly convincing claim. Of course, if you're scum it casts doubt on his claim, but beside some vague tinglies there's nothing to indicate you are, yet.
Purple felt and still feels very townie to me. Whoopee friggin do, we have similar reads.
Notty is suspicious not for disagreeing with you (my, you're pretty self-centered aren't ya?) but rather for not being swayed in the slightest by any of the alternative clock face possibilities offered. Notty remains, as far as I can see, far too convinced that the clock is a cop despite mounting evidence that it gives an effect (blue seems to roleblock both players it points to) and, perhaps more importantly, Notty's color conjectures offered with no reasoning at all beyond things like "red seems like an aggressive color" appeared to be trying way too hard.
Why would I vote for Notty? Like Kroppeb, it's a lynch that I don't have enough evidence or sway to make happen at this point.
Kroppeb? Oh look, I just answered that one. I don't have enough evidence or sway to make a Kroppeb lynch happen at this point. But my reasoning should be pretty clear. We know TehBrian claimed to put his reflection up in front of Inffy. I think Inffy, assuming he's town, would be the most likely n0 target for the mafia. Using how the reflections apparently work, if Inffy was targeted and had a reflector, it must have come from Kroppeb.
Push on Omni? Why would I object to a lynch of Omni? As I said above, I don't think I can get a Notty or Kroppeb lynch to happen, but Omni makes sense as someone I scumread before and continue to scumread.
Said I'm trying to be on your good side? Not at all, don't twist my words like that. I said that I didn't want to go after Inffy without solid evidence beyond just a read, because of how badly that went for me, and how wrong I turned out to be, last game we played together. And this one, this one must have been phrased purposefully. Inffy must know he's twisting my words here, suggesting a hidden agenda.
Reconsidering my read on you if Omni flipped scum? I already answered this one in the above post.
To Inffy's second last point, it almost seems as though he's scumreading me because other people haven't answered my question? That sounds pretty ridiculous, so I think I must have misunderstood this one. The false modesty at the end of it doesn't help matters either.
And the final point? That Dess's read of me seems fake therefore I seem suspicious? If Inffy didn't have a secret agenda I'd expect him to ask Dess why he had this read rather than conclude it was a fake read and then use it against me. This definitely feels like trying to frame something the way he wants it. I'm not sure if it's tunnel vision or being mafia or what, but Inffy seems off.
Now how about those concrete facts that are oh so very much more useful than reads, hmm? Two points to consider.
I was the first person to come out and say I wasn't a flower. No mafia would risk this, as it would have seemed suicidal. And no, this isn't my point, it was made back on d0.
MoltenAshes and I have the same role. I'm not sure if Molten is convinced of this yet; if they are they can vouch for me, if not they should be able to, without too much difficulty, find a way to convince themself.
It's this second one that I think should be pretty convincing; It's not absolute proof of course, but it would be quite a feat for two mafia to pull...
I was the first person to come out and say I wasn't a flower. No mafia would risk this, as it would have seemed suicidal. And no, this isn't my point, it was made back on d0.
MoltenAshes and I have the same role. I'm not sure if Molten is convinced of this yet; if they are they can vouch for me, if not they should be able to, without too much difficulty, find a way to convince themself.
It's this second one that I think should be pretty convincing; It's not absolute proof of course, but it would be quite a feat for two mafia to pull...
—— Voting Recap ——
Deadline: 31 March 2019 UTC 22:00.
Deadline: 31 March 2019 UTC 22:00.
Omni - 5 (Nottykitten, Purplepixies, MoltenAshes, TehBrian, Vyryn) [L-3]
Purplepixies - 3 (Stranger from planet 9, Timdood3, Aqua) [L-5]
Vyryn - 2 (Infected_Alien8, Omni) [L-6]
With 14 players, it takes 8 votes to lynch and 7 votes to no-lynch.
If no option reaches the required number of votes when a deadline hits, the day will end as a no lynch.
The following posts are the ones that are making me scumread purple:
This is the main that makes me think Purple might be scum. The first one especially so because she she seems weirdly confident about it. It was honestly just a feeling at the start, but the fact that she didn't say much more about the whole 'reflection' theory makes me think she at least knows more about the clock than she's letting on. That combined with her saltiness makes me think that it's very unlikely that she's town.
Infected_alien8_
Garry's Mod Admin
Not at all. Last game I misread you as mafia because you kept saying I'd done things that I hadn't, and when I asked you to find quotes you brought up ones that weren't relevant. E.g. saying I was edging on choco to lynch beez and then quoting me defending beez. It made me think you were faking reads. And you didn't defend beez when your scumread (choco) was leading a lynch on him, and I didn't believe you when you said you planned to but were focusing on me first because I thought you'd have prioritized defending beez. On the final day of your life I started to change my mind on you but then psycho hammered you
It's not the fact you have a similar read to me that bothers me. It's that you said:
"a freaking grandmaster mafia we'd better all start bowing to" is how you describe her, but your points about why you town read her just don't feel strong enough to justify you feeling so strongly that she's town. "seemed rather townie" doesn't sound like a mafia grandmaster. "looks like a genuine panic attack over 4 votes" doesn't sound like one either since mafia could panic over 4 votes as well. Sure you say you agree that #432 is accurate but just that doesn't seem to justify her being a 'freaking grandmaster mafia' either. I just don't understand why you have such a strong read on her so as a result it feels a bit fake. I know maybe you just didn't communicate it in detail but that's why it made me feel that way.
That's not what I was trying to say. I'm saying I think you faked the read to scumread notty to set her up for a mislynch, and simultaneously used that read to buddy up to me by mentioning how my argument was strong. Because that's how it felt to me. Sure maybe you genuinely just wanted to say that, but it felt like you were trying to suck up to me.
But what exactly do you think notty is trying to accomplish with that as mafia? What links her being so insistent on the dial being a cop to her being scum? What do you mean by "trying way too hard"?
Fair enough if that's how you see it. If it were me I'd vote them even if it was just me, because I think they're scum and if I vote for them maybe someone will see them as a viable lynch and join me.
It's not just the fact you pushed on him that I found suspicious. It was the way you did it. It felt like fake belief in him flipping town. I don't know why exactly, it just did, I didn't feel any conviction or excitement from you that we'd found scum.
Ahem:
No, it's because when nobody answered, you didn't follow up and re-ask it. If I really wanted to know the answer to whether you're capable of doing x as mafia and I asked and nobody answered, I'd ask again, because I'd assume someone would have at least some opinion on it because it seems they've played with you before. That's what I'd do, so I'm comparing that with you. It's shaky grounds for a read I know, and it's a small thing that only occurred to me whilst I was writing that post and wasn't one of the reasons I decided to vote you, but it's something that could also be a clue to the fact you're not bothered about actually sussing me out.
It's not false modesty. As I say in that reads list, I felt my reads this game have been thin. I still think that. If you think they're insightful that's nice, I'm just questioning whether you actually believe it because again, I'm comparing what I see to what you're saying you see and it doesn't match. I know it's possible you genuinely think it's insightful but after how insightful I found you last game, I feel like your standard for 'really damn insightful' would be higher than that. The one thing I can see why you'd think I was insightful on in that reads list is my read on Aqua but the others I just don't see why you were 'impressed' by those.
For example, you bolded:
I doubt he'll be on in time for deadline judging by his pattern of activity so far
Not sure why this is insightful?
didn't feel like she was just pretending not to understand.
Again not sure why this is insightful since it's just my 'feeling' so I don't know how you'd read that and think 'mm insightful'. Maybe you just agreed with it and thought 'wow he's seeing what I'm seeing, insightful' I guess?
The others I guess I can see where you're coming from actually. I'm just suspicious that you're trying to manipulate me so I guess I'm being sensitive to anything I think might be that, because I don't want you to manipulate me.
I did ask him. He said it was just vibes.
Both you and dess have given each other a town read where I personally haven't felt it was warranted. So it makes you a fairly compatible team who are trying to defend each other. Choco said when you were mafia you panicked when your team were in trouble so I'm expecting you to be defending them/trying to keep them out of harm's way if you're mafia, and Dess fits that, and Dess returning the favour would make sense as well since I can see Dess doing that.
That's true. But it's also an excellent way of saying 'I'd never do this as mafia so you can trust me' and hope people agree with you, and you look extra townie, so I'm not giving you much credit for that.
You and molten having the same role means nothing to me in terms of your alignment. Unless your role seems inherently town I doubt it'd make me town read you just because you both have the same role. There have been plenty of games with mafia replications of town roles in the same game.
Anyway, I don't know about you. I guess I can see where you might be coming from. It's just if it's not you then who the heck is it? Most people seem relatively townie. I'm finding this game difficult so far.
You, omni, Dess, brian and kropp are the ones out of everyone I have some kind of doubt, enough compared to everyone else that I feel as though I'd be happy lynching you. If you guys aren't scum then where the heck are the scum? I could see stranger or tim as third party though.
Infected_alien8_
Garry's Mod Admin
Woops the quote disappeared?
Let me try that again.
Ahem:
MoltenAshes
Member
I can vouch with 90% certainty that we have the same role.
Infected_alien8_
Garry's Mod Admin
(as in I can see why someone would bold them when identifying something that is 'insightful' but I still don't think it warrants 'really damn insightful' and they'd have just been 'ok level of insight but nothing impressive' to me)
I'm not sure what response you'd like. I think I pretty effectively explained my reasoning for all of your points, and don't see getting into a back and forth about minutia beyond that as very useful. If you have another explicit question or two for me, that might be productive, but beyond that I think I don't think I need to give a response to what was said in #1238.
I think it's very conceivable town has two of our role, and I would be quite surprised if mafia and town had the same role with the same name (it seems very likely we have exactly the same role name, not just ability).
I think it's very conceivable town has two of our role, and I would be quite surprised if mafia and town had the same role with the same name (it seems very likely we have exactly the same role name, not just ability).
Infected_alien8_
Garry's Mod Admin
I wasn't really looking for a response, just explaining myself.
Although I do wonder what's going through your mind now that I've pointed out that you did in fact say you were trying to stay on my good side, since you acted as though that was incriminating and that I was purposefully twisting your words as scum
Infected_alien8_
Garry's Mod Admin
Also to further my point from before, if I go over some of the quotes you pointed out that you said warranted you calling my reads 'really damn insightful':
makes sense hk would see me suspect him and get paranoid I'm setting him up for a lynch since I've done that quite a bit
if you don't know hk then I guess I can see why you'd appreciate this information but I'd use the word 'useful' rather than 'insightful' in that case
his turn around on me when he suddenly thinks I'm scum felt genuine
don't really see how this is insightful unless you already saw the same thing as me and appreciated the fact I saw it too and thought it was therefore insightful. otherwise it's just me saying it 'felt' a certain way and I don't give much of a reason for you to agree with me
I doubt he'll be on in time for deadline judging by his pattern of activity so far
don't see how you'd see this as insightful
if he doesn't deliver and feels underwhelming then I'd be suspicious of him.
if you agree that this is how you'd behave as mafia then I can see why you'd think of this as insightful? but it seems like a fairly basic concept of 'if someone isn't delivering the scumhunting they do as town then be suspicious of them' so again I don't feel this justifies 'really damn insightful'
didn't feel like she was just pretending not to understand.
And again it's just me saying how I feel so not really insightful unless it's something you were seeing yourself and appreciated me seeing it too or something
There were a couple things I said where I can see why you might consider them insightful like my read on aqua or possibly my read on brian about not wanting to let his team down, but calling the post 'really damn insightful' seems inaccurate and makes me paranoid you're trying to butter me up to get me to town read you
makes sense hk would see me suspect him and get paranoid I'm setting him up for a lynch since I've done that quite a bit
if you don't know hk then I guess I can see why you'd appreciate this information but I'd use the word 'useful' rather than 'insightful' in that case
his turn around on me when he suddenly thinks I'm scum felt genuine
don't really see how this is insightful unless you already saw the same thing as me and appreciated the fact I saw it too and thought it was therefore insightful. otherwise it's just me saying it 'felt' a certain way and I don't give much of a reason for you to agree with me
I doubt he'll be on in time for deadline judging by his pattern of activity so far
don't see how you'd see this as insightful
if he doesn't deliver and feels underwhelming then I'd be suspicious of him.
if you agree that this is how you'd behave as mafia then I can see why you'd think of this as insightful? but it seems like a fairly basic concept of 'if someone isn't delivering the scumhunting they do as town then be suspicious of them' so again I don't feel this justifies 'really damn insightful'
didn't feel like she was just pretending not to understand.
And again it's just me saying how I feel so not really insightful unless it's something you were seeing yourself and appreciated me seeing it too or something
There were a couple things I said where I can see why you might consider them insightful like my read on aqua or possibly my read on brian about not wanting to let his team down, but calling the post 'really damn insightful' seems inaccurate and makes me paranoid you're trying to butter me up to get me to town read you
MoltenAshes
Member
Depends mainly on if someone specific other than me or vyryn is town/mafia.
MoltenAshes
Member
Vyryn You know who I'm talking about?