The difference between assuming and thinking something is likely is pretty minor. Try again.
[GAME OVER] Formula Mafia
- Thread starter Ltin
- Start date
Infected_alien8_
Garry's Mod Admin
but why does context of d0 make you think you might be too harsh on finding pg 70-80 as frantic/scummy?
why does it turning out to be a fake claim make boo's doubts make any more sense?
i just dont get what it means
what point though im so CONFUSED
Infected_alien8_
Garry's Mod Admin
are you sure
assuming is very different from thinking something is likely
honestly idk why youre being so hostile with me, its not my fault your role is scummy, you literally said yourself you dont disagree with my logic so??? why are you acting like im being unreasonable
i assumed nothing at all so stop acting like i did. try again.
Because roles with a lot of nuts and bolts to them, so to speak, tend to be 3p.
Because then id be arguing largely against people's feelings about my role rather than anything of substance. If you'd care to explain to me how to accomplish that I'm all ears.
She specifically claimed a weaker version of my/Mooglie's role, which by the nature of being weaker, is more believable to be town bc townies generally have weaker roles than mafia/3p.
Explain how I'm supposed to read this as anything other than an assumption.
Infected_alien8_
Garry's Mod Admin
also idk if this is about me or not but
if two messengers claimed id not think one is scum necessarily for example, its not that i dont think there can ever be two of the same ability for town
but two blockers does seem pretty town sided compared to most setups which is why i said it seemed unlikely
Infected_alien8_
Garry's Mod Admin
by reading the words i used instead of imagining it to say "stranger's confirmed scum"?
saying "this sounds scummy" isnt "this is confirmed scum", its saying "this sounds scummy". idk how you think thats an assumption
Likely as a chaos starter. Not very Townie, though.
To get the Race Director to out themselves, while, at the same time, pinning the broadcast on Boooo. Maybe this is reverse psychology, to get us to believe Boooo is a Townie, when in fact, she isn't?
Granted, we have a small enough reason to believe she is an Alignment Cop, that didn't investigate, but you wouldn't have known that during planning Night One.
I definitely think Stranger is Third Party, guven their role and goals, which also makes it seem as if Third Parties may be on a more even scale with Town? Unless it's just going to be difficult for her to win.
I'M SO SORRY DESS
Wait, where is this random FoS coming from? Any reasoning for Okx specifically? o 3o
Granted, looking at my chart, the odds are increasing for who it could be, out of everyone who hasn't claimed.
I mean, if we have a Town Messager, wouldn't that mean Hip's claim would be Mafia or Third Party? I'd like to see a claim with some evidence or reasoning first, before even jumping on that.
They called me out for being emotional and read deep into emotions D0, when those emotions were not there; I called them out and they seemed genuinely regretful of their behavior. So in context I could be committing the same mistake in reading/misreading their conduct.
How would it not? If Boo didn't buy a claim, and the claim turned out to be fake, that means their reservations can be seen as valid. I don't understand why you're confused on this one.
1. Don't believe Oog's read on you given what I've got from his posts.
2. Tim death was never a guarantee, which Oog has been adamant about.
3. Your scumread on Notty is fair b/c of Notty's style, and it is NAI.
4. Scum!Inf is more focused, town!Inf flails more. Current actions don't really point to scum!Inf.
5. Claim withholding is sketchy and Oog isn't off on calling this out.
The second part was re: Oog questioning my usage of misguided, which was clarified; earlier it seemed he thought us sharing a Notty tr meant Oog had to be town/not-misguided town in this scenario.
Point being that Oog was using Tim's death/the circumstances about it as proof of scum!Inf. If that were the case I would expect a greater push against you, and the only one holding the torch is Oog. There has been no bus to speak of.
The fact that you were willing to put a vote on me and encourage others to do the same, even through misremembered information (e.g. saying I had explicitly claimed town even though I hadn't done so) is very close to an assumption even if it wasnt quite there by your definition.
Town JOATs exist. And like I said, these role madness/closed set-up games leave room for craziness. It's almost an expectation.
Sell it w/charisma, logic, break down the mechanics of the game. Could be difficult, fair, but claiming 3P doesn't help and could have turned you into a quick autolynch for scum to bail on.
Infected_alien8_
Garry's Mod Admin
thats not true though - if you found it unreasonable to doubt a 3p because town or scum don't benefit from claiming 3p, only 3p does, then stranger actually turning out to be town and boo being right shouldnt change that fact, so im confused as to where youre coming from
why would me killing tim make me confirmed scum and thus warrant a bus from my team to look out for? or are you just argueing against the fact that im proven scum by saying if inf was proven scum his team would be bussing him?
Infected_alien8_
Garry's Mod Admin
so are you saying every time somebody places a vote on someone and scumreads someone, they're "assuming" that person is scum?
do you only ever vote people who youre "assuming" to be scum then?
like i dont understand why you think i made an assumption, i didnt
I'm reading this as saying that these closer setups are inherently chaotic yet I should logic/analysis to defend myself in a setting that doesn't always conform to what people's expectations of a logical setup would be. Is that correct?
Because Stranger making a fakeclaim doesn't make me buy another claim from them. Boo not believing it makes sense because it turned out to be false and I don't see Stranger as town for making the fake; the town motivation isn't there FMPOV.
I am arguing against Tim death confirming you scum, b/c it doesn't add up.
It wasn't just your vote it was the fact that you were fairly actively pushing others to vote me as well.
Infected_alien8_
Garry's Mod Admin
i still dont see how stranger turning out to be town suddenly means boo's argument makes sense to you
and i dont really get the argument about "tims death doesnt confirm inf as scum because his buddies arent bussing him" either; my teammates bussing me requires my teammates to think im confirmed scum, so thats irrelevant to whether oog thinks it makes me confirmed scum or not
Point being there is plenty of room for different roles; claiming your role as it was described is not inherently AI. The chaos means roles that are not typical are expected, and only by explaining those roles/putting them into context can the set-up start to make sense. You claim your role is inherently one that would be an autolynch when that's never guaranteed.
Claiming 3P does not solve anything here, or at the very least you have not elaborated on how it could solve anything; all it has done is make me doubt the claim and put other reads in a flux.
Infected_alien8_
Garry's Mod Admin
so you only try to get others to lynch your suspect if you "assume" them to be scum?
because i definitely dont
you werent confirmed scum to me by any means
You missed the part where I didn't buy Stranger as town.
Except the argument was this: if Tim death = confirmed scum Inf, then massive push would happen = most likely a bus, but the opposite has happened and Oog is the only one making a push. This is going by the logic that Tim's death itself was enough of a 'writing on the wall' sign that a bus would be seen as viable by teammates.
Infected_alien8_
Garry's Mod Admin
whys that relevant
you didnt think boo doubting stranger's 3p was reasonable, as you dont think doubting 3p claims makes sense
then stranger turned out to not be 3p and suddenly you think boo doubting is reasonable? that'd only work if you think boo had inside knowledge about stranger's true alignment
ok, but i dont really get why this argument was necessary at all then? youre argueing against the fact that im globally considered to be confirmed scum, by saying people arent voting me?
This assumes Boo isn't capable of making that read. Difficult, sure, but inside info isn't necessitated to make that happen.
Because Oog made this argument? This is getting excessive.
Infected_alien8_
Garry's Mod Admin
so are you saying
if someone reads x as scum for reason y, and you think reason y is ridiculous and doesnt make sense, BUT x then turns out to be scum, youd then find reason y to be reasonable? since that seems to be your argument which doesnt make sense right?
oog never said i was globally scumread, hes not stupid, he'd know i wasnt by the fact i wasnt being lynched already
You're assuming it inherently doesn't make sense when it could have been a misread, which happens. Basically this assumes there's never a world where Boo calls this out the fake.
He seems convinced you are 100% scum. Do you not see this or do you choose to ignore it?
Infected_alien8_
Garry's Mod Admin
(sorry if this comes off as aggressive btw i didnt mean for it to, im not implying youre stupid for argueing it, im just saying, oog would have to be stupid to think im globally scumread and he obv isnt stupid so i dont get why youre argueing with him about this as if you believe he thinks im globally scumread)